The Judd Lienhard Podcast

Jon Heck returns to The Judd Lienhard Podcast for an objective discussion about anabolic steroids, TRT, performance-enhancing drugs, nutrition, bodybuilding, athletic performance, and long-term health.
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In a fitness industry full of extremes, Judd and Jon take a balanced approach to one of the most controversial topics in strength training. Rather than glorifying or demonizing performance-enhancing drugs, they break down what anabolic steroids actually do, what they don't do, and why nutrition remains the biggest driver of physique transformation.
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The conversation explores the differences between natural and enhanced athletes, how steroids affect muscle growth and recovery, common side effects, TRT, growth hormone, insulin, peptides, tendon injuries, and the long-term realities of hormone use.
Jon shares insights from years of coaching athletes and bodybuilders, while Judd provides perspective from his background in strength and performance coaching. Together, they unpack many of the myths surrounding steroids, including "roid rage," athletic performance enhancement, and the belief that drugs alone create elite physiques.
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This episode is brought to you by David Protein
David Protein has the highest protein-to-calorie ratio of any leading bar in the market. David Protein Gold label has: 28g of protein, 150 calories, and 0g of sugar. And equally as important, this bar tastes delicious. Each bar features an indulgent, doughy texture, studded with satisfying chunks and airy crisps. Other bars are hard to choke down, but I often eat 2 David Protein bars in a sitting, they are that good. Try them for yourself.
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This episode is brought to you by LMNT
Optimal hydration doesn’t just mean more fluids, it means getting the right electrolyte balance. Make your purchase through my link to receive a free LMNT Sample Pack featuring the most popular flavors: drinklmnt.com/judd
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David protein bars have the best protein/calorie ratio on the market. Get free shipping on your first order by going to davidprotein.com/judd
Bro splits have become the punching bag of the modern fitness industry.
According to social media, if you're not doing full body workouts, functional fitness, CrossFit, athletic performance training, or some version of high-frequency programming, you're wasting your time.
But is that actually true?
In this solo episode, Judd defends one of the most criticized training methods in fitness: body part split training. While he still believes full body training is one of the best options for many people, he explains why bro splits continue to work, why they're often misunderstood, and why context matters more than internet fitness dogma.
Judd breaks down the real-world advantages and disadvantages of different workout splits, including full body training, push-pull-legs, upper-lower splits, and traditional bodybuilding routines. He also discusses why the obsession with finding the "optimal" training program often causes people to miss the bigger picture.
This episode is brought to you by David Protein
David Protein has the highest protein-to-calorie ratio of any leading bar in the market. David Protein Gold label has: 28g of protein, 150 calories, and 0g of sugar. And equally as important, this bar tastes delicious. Each bar features an indulgent, doughy texture, studded with satisfying chunks and airy crisps. Other bars are hard to choke down, but I often eat 2 David Protein bars in a sitting, they are that good. Try them for yourself.
Order here for free shipping on your first order: davidprotein.com/judd
This episode is brought to you by LMNT
Optimal hydration doesn’t just mean more fluids, it means getting the right electrolyte balance. Make your purchase through my link to receive a free LMNT Sample Pack featuring the most popular flavors: drinklmnt.com/judd
Enjoyed this conversation? Consider sharing it with a friend. Subscribe, Rate, & Review to help us bring you more epic conversations. ⭐️🎧🔥

Phil Daru joins Judd Lienhard for a deep conversation on elite performance, strength and conditioning, mental toughness, resilience, leadership, and the habits that create long-term success.
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As a former professional MMA fighter and three-time World MMA Awards Strength & Conditioning Coach of the Year, Phil has worked with UFC champions, elite athletes, executives, and high performers across multiple industries.
In this episode, Phil and Judd discuss:
 The principles behind championship-level performance 
 Why order and virtue matter in life and training 
 Recovery, HRV, and fatigue management 
 Building resilience through failure 
 The importance of preparation 
 Coaching psychology and communication 
 Developing athletes and future leaders 
 Parenting, purpose, and legacy 
 Conditioning strategies for everyday people 
 What separates great performers from everyone else 
Follow Phil:
https://www.instagram.com/darustrong/
This episode is packed with actionable lessons for athletes, coaches, entrepreneurs, executives, parents, and anyone pursuing excellence.
This episode is brought to you by David Protein
David Protein has the highest protein-to-calorie ratio of any leading bar in the market. David Protein Gold label has: 28g of protein, 150 calories, and 0g of sugar. And equally as important, this bar tastes delicious. Each bar features an indulgent, doughy texture, studded with satisfying chunks and airy crisps. Other bars are hard to choke down, but I often eat 2 David Protein bars in a sitting, they are that good. Try them for yourself.
Order here for free shipping on your first order: davidprotein.com/judd
This episode is brought to you by LMNT
Optimal hydration doesn’t just mean more fluids, it means getting the right electrolyte balance. Make your purchase through my link to receive a free LMNT Sample Pack featuring the most popular flavors: drinklmnt.com/judd
Enjoyed this conversation? Consider sharing it with a friend. Subscribe, Rate, & Review to help us bring you more epic conversations. ⭐️🎧🔥

In this Q&A episode, Judd answers listener questions about CrossFit, training to failure, stubborn belly fat, knee pain, rucking, posture correction, and smarter ways to build muscle without wrecking your body.
Judd explains what CrossFit got right, where modern fitness culture goes wrong, and why many lifters misunderstand concepts like intensity, functional training, and hypertrophy.
He also dives into:
How to build quads with bad knees
Why eccentric training matters
The best exercises for desk workers
Fixing posture and hip tightness
Whether you should train while sick
If rucking hurts strength gains
How to eat high protein without living on chicken and rice
This episode is packed with practical training advice for lifters, athletes, and anyone trying to get stronger, leaner, and healthier long term.
Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
00:00:37 CrossFit criticism
00:06:09 Fixing posture from sitting all day
00:09:15 Training to failure explained
00:11:16 Building quads with bad knees
00:16:08 Belly fat, hormones & alcohol
00:18:18 Training while sick
00:19:57 Does rucking hurt gains?
00:21:34 Programming “weird” exercises
00:24:28 Protein sources for fat loss
This episode is brought to you by David Protein
David Protein has the highest protein-to-calorie ratio of any leading bar in the market. David Protein Gold label has: 28g of protein, 150 calories, and 0g of sugar. And equally as important, this bar tastes delicious. Each bar features an indulgent, doughy texture, studded with satisfying chunks and airy crisps. Other bars are hard to choke down, but I often eat 2 David Protein bars in a sitting, they are that good. Try them for yourself.
Order here for free shipping on your first order: davidprotein.com/judd
This episode is brought to you by LMNT
Optimal hydration doesn’t just mean more fluids, it means getting the right electrolyte balance. Make your purchase through my link to receive a free LMNT Sample Pack featuring the most popular flavors: drinklmnt.com/judd
Enjoyed this conversation? Consider sharing it with a friend. Subscribe, Rate, & Review to help us bring you more epic conversations. ⭐️🎧🔥

VO2 max has officially become the latest obsession in the fitness world — but are people completely misunderstanding what the science actually says?
In this solo episode, Judd breaks down the truth about VO2 max, longevity training, Norwegian 4x4 workouts, Zone 2 cardio, HIIT, and cardiovascular health. He explains why having a high VO2 max matters, but why constantly doing “VO2 max training” may not be the best solution for most people.
Judd dives into the physiology behind aerobic fitness and explains how lung capacity, heart function, red blood cell count, mitochondrial density, body composition, and general physical activity all contribute to longevity and overall health.
He also discusses why fitness influencers and social media gurus often take scientific studies out of context — turning nuanced research into oversimplified training advice that doesn’t work for the average person.
This episode covers:
What VO2 max actually measures
Why VO2 max is strongly linked to longevity
The problem with Norwegian 4x4 workouts for beginners
Why low-intensity cardio still matters
Zone 2 vs HIIT vs VO2 max training
The role of body weight in cardiovascular health
Why consistency beats intensity for most people
How fitness studies get misinterpreted online
Why balanced training is more important than trends
Strength training, endurance training, and long-term health
The difference between correlation and causation in exercise science
Whether you’re trying to improve your health, lose weight, build endurance, optimize performance, or simply live longer, this episode provides a practical and balanced perspective on cardiovascular fitness that cuts through the internet hype.
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Timestamps:
00:00 – Why everyone is suddenly obsessed with VO2 max
02:10 – What VO2 max actually measures
05:08 – Why VO2 max training is misunderstood
08:15 – Lung capacity and breathing mechanics
11:22 – Oxygen delivery, red blood cells, and mitochondria
14:48 – Why body weight impacts VO2 max
18:05 – The problem with Norwegian 4x4 workouts
21:44 – Building sustainable exercise habits
25:10 – HIIT vs steady-state cardio
29:02 – Heart elasticity and aerobic conditioning
33:28 – Why balanced fitness matters
37:10 – Fitness guru culture and internet misinformation
41:55 – Strength training and cardiovascular health
45:40 – Correlation vs causation in exercise science
49:30 – Misinterpreted steroid studies and research
55:18 – What actually improves longevity
59:42 – Final thoughts on VO2 max training
This episode is brought to you by David Protein
David Protein has the highest protein-to-calorie ratio of any leading bar in the market. David Protein Gold label has: 28g of protein, 150 calories, and 0g of sugar. And equally as important, this bar tastes delicious. Each bar features an indulgent, doughy texture, studded with satisfying chunks and airy crisps. Other bars are hard to choke down, but I often eat 2 David Protein bars in a sitting, they are that good. Try them for yourself.
Order here for free shipping on your first order: davidprotein.com/judd
This episode is brought to you by LMNT
Optimal hydration doesn’t just mean more fluids, it means getting the right electrolyte balance. Make your purchase through my link to receive a free LMNT Sample Pack featuring the most popular flavors: drinklmnt.com/judd
Enjoyed this conversation? Consider sharing it with a friend. Subscribe, Rate, & Review to help us bring you more epic conversations. ⭐️🎧🔥