Alt Goes Mainstream: The Latest on Alternative Investments, WealthTech, & Private Markets

Welcome back to the Alt Goes Mainstream podcast.
We were live from AGM’s RIA Field Trip at Brookfield’s New York office at Brookfield Place with Oaktree Managing Director and Co-Portfolio Manager Danielle Poli to unpack why private credit is at a crossroads and why dispersion is growing. 
Danielle has a unique perch to form a developed view on the current state of private credit. She sits at the intersection of public and private credit, providing her with perspectives on where opportunities and risks lie across the liquidity spectrum. 
Danielle is a founding member of Oaktree’s Global Credit strategy and its Investment Committee, which was established in 2017. She’s been an important contributor to its growth into a scaled multi-asset credit platform. She previously led Oaktree’s product specialist group, which she helped build into a global team supporting credit, private equity, and real estate. She joined Oaktree in 201 and has nearly two decades of experience in private markets. She has been named to Barron’s list of the 100 Most Influential Women in U.S. Finance. 
Danielle and I had a fascinating conversation about the current state of private credit, where cracks might be emerging and where to find pockets of opportunity amid the dislocations. We covered:
Why is boring beautiful in private credit?
Where are we in the credit cycle?
Why it’s important to have a contrarian mindset.
Where, why, and how dispersion is rising in credit.
How to underwrite software investments post-AI. 
Why asset-backed finance can be a diversifier.
Why now could be the time to prepare for opportunistic and rescue lending opportunities, as maturities are fast approaching.
How to balance public and private credit investing. 
Thanks, Danielle, for sharing your wisdom, expertise, and passion about private credit. 

Show Notes
00:00 Live Podcast Intro
00:06 Meet Danielle Poli
00:17 Contrarian Mindset 
00:34 Our Sponsor, Ultimus Fund Solutions
01:32 Where Private Credit Stands Today
02:22 Bifurcation and ABF Rise
02:59 Liquid vs Private Convergence
03:36 Danielle’s Career Background
04:13 Why Liquidity Matters
04:39 Dislocation Advantages
05:10 Risk Return Tradeoffs
05:18 Liquidity Premium Compression
05:41 Covenants and Complexity
06:01 Not All Private Credit is Equal
06:34 Corporate vs Asset-Backed
07:05 Why ABF Diversifies
07:30 How Allocators Fund ABF
07:49 Credit Taking Share from Equities
08:49 Tough Direct Lending Vintages
09:22 Rates Shock and Leverage
09:43 AI Disrupts Software Credit
10:41 Oaktree Software Underweight
12:01 Underwriting Software Post AI
12:57 Inside the Investment Committee
13:57 Selling Rallies and Positioning
31:30 Closing Thoughts

A Word from Our Sponsor, Ultimus
This episode of Alt Goes Mainstream is brought to you by Ultimus, the full-service fund administrator and transfer agent powering asset managers in private and public markets. As alts go mainstream, you need real expertise to handle complex fund structures, connect with key distribution partners, and handle sophisticated compliance, reporting, and transparency demands.
That’s Ultimus: high-tech, high-touch solutions for over 450 clients and 2,500 funds with $775B in assets under administration. Backed by an expert team of over 1,200 employees, they place client service at the core of their business, helping you navigate complexity during your fund structuring or launch and then supporting you through every stage of growth. Whether you’re already in the market or thinking about entering private wealth, you can trust their team’s deep expertise in retail alternatives to help you reach your goals.
Learn more at ultimusfundsolutions.com or email info@ultimusfundsolutions.com.
We thank Ultimus for their support of alts going mainstream.

Welcome back to the Alt Goes Mainstream podcast.
Building community is central to enabling an industry to grow. There are few better ways to build community and foster trusted relationships than to break bread. 
As the wealth channel continues to expand its adoption of private markets, peer-to-peer learning becomes ever more important. Sharing experiences and perspectives is what will help the wealth channel adopt private market solutions thoughtfully and responsibly.
That’s what happened at Franklin Templeton’s Private Markets RIA Advisory Council event and dinner at BLACKBARN recently. Bread was broken. Relationships were built. 
We also found time to record a podcast at a dinner table with Franklin Templeton’s Head of Private Markets - Americas Wealth Management Dave Donahoo and Summit Wealth Group’s CIO Chelsea Ganey. The discussion granted access to a direct, honest, and raw window into perspectives on how asset managers and wealth managers can work together to educate one another and help move the industry forward. And yes, bread was broken before and after the podcast.
Please enjoy this fantastic conversation with Dave and Chelsea on the state of private markets and private wealth and how both asset managers and wealth managers can balance customization and differentiation with scale.
Thanks, Dave and Chelsea, for such a thoughtful and fascinating conversation.
Show Notes
00:00 A message from Ultimus, our Sponsor
00:57 Meet The Guests
01:07 Private Markets Are Eating World
01:29 Why Create RIA Council
01:49 Franklin Client-First DNA
02:09 From Public To Private
02:43 Listening Beyond Product
03:07 Peer To Peer Insights
04:12 Chelsea On The Benefits of Advisory Council
04:36 Inbox Overload And Filtering
05:10 Serving Diverse RIA Needs
06:15 Many RIAs Within One
06:30 What CIOs Need Most
06:54 Educating Advisors At Scale
07:32 GPs Must Listen Better
08:26 What Education Really Means
09:01 Repeatable Advisor Resources
09:54 Avoid Oversimplifying Complexity
10:30 Education Shifts To Choice
11:50 Balancing Choice And Customization
13:13 Centralized Menu For Scale
15:10 Sober Selling And Integrity
16:30 Franklin Private Markets Platform
17:59 Specialist Managers Model
18:28 Infrastructure Partnership Play
19:22 Do More With Less Managers
21:04 Holistic Options For Advisors
21:47 Where Product Innovation Goes
22:23 Sun Moon Stars Aligning
22:53 Future Access 401k Models
23:12 Start With Investment Why
23:29 Allocator Innovation Lens
24:09 Models Versus Customization
24:35 Why Innovation Matters
24:53 No One Right Way
25:18 Whats Still Missing
25:33 Scaling And The Middle
25:55 Magic Wand Question
26:19 Plumbing And Reporting
26:32 Perpetual Structure Tradeoffs
26:46 Protecting Investment Integrity
27:30 Long Term Over Short Term
27:42 Need More CIO Mindsets
28:03 Strategic Allocation For Alts
28:50 Chelsea On Strategic Framing
29:34 Making Liquidity Intuitive
30:06 Educating On Liquidity Risk
30:29 Private Markets Risk Reframe
31:32 Dave On Portfolio Construction
32:14 Standardizing Industry Terms
32:42 Building Trust With Liquidity
33:45 A Fun Question
38:10 Client Analogies That Stick
40:43 Fat Pitch Opportunities Today
42:53 Closing Thoughts And Thanks

A Word from Our Sponsor, Ultimus
This episode of Alt Goes Mainstream is brought to you by Ultimus, the full-service fund administrator and transfer agent powering asset managers in private and public markets. As alts go mainstream, you need real expertise to handle complex fund structures, connect with key distribution partners, and handle sophisticated compliance, reporting, and transparency demands.
That’s Ultimus: high-tech, high-touch solutions for over 450 clients and 2,500 funds with $775B in assets under administration. Backed by an expert team of over 1,200 employees, they place client service at the core of their business, helping you navigate complexity during your fund structuring or launch and then supporting you through every stage of growth. Whether you’re already in the market or thinking about entering private wealth, you can trust their team’s deep expertise in retail alternatives to help you reach your goals.
Learn more at ultimusfundsolutions.com or email info@ultimusfundsolutions.com.
We thank Ultimus for their support of alts going mainstream.

Welcome back to the Alt Goes Mainstream podcast.
We went to a mecca of football to film the latest episode. This conversation takes us to Turin, Italy, where we were in the Juventus Creator Lab with Italian football (I mean soccer for the Americans) legend and one of the best defenders of all time Giorgio Chiellini.
Giorgio’s career and playing style were defined by Juventus’ very motto, fino alla fine (“until the end”). It’s also a mentality that he brings to every aspect of life on and off the pitch. 
After an illustrious playing career at one of the world’s biggest clubs, Juventus, and a career that also included two World Cup appearances for Italy and winning the Euro 2020 as the Captain of Italy, Giorgio came back home to Turin rejoin the club where he starred for 17 years: Juventus. Giorgio has gone from the pitch to the boardroom, helping to lead Juventus as the Director of Football Strategy. He has brought the player’s perspective to the business side of football, balancing the nuances of sports and business.
Despite the demands that Giorgio faced on the field as a player to maintain a standard of play at the highest levels of the game, he found time during his career to pursue his passion for business. He received his MBA while playing for Juventus and also was involved in the player development side in his final years as a player at LAFC. More recently, he became an investor in LAFC and in Mercury13, a multi-club investor in women’s football teams, including FC Como. He’s also an active investor in the European startup community.
Giorgio and I had a wide-ranging and fascinating conversation that covered several dimensions of the business of sport. We discussed:
How teams, owners, and investors can balance both the sport and business aspects of the game.
What it means for sports now that players can have bigger social followings than their clubs or leagues.
How Juventus has built and amplified its brand through initiatives like the Creator Lab.
How clubs like Juventus can help players build their off-field brand while maintaining a high-quality on-field product.
How Giorgio’s work off the field while playing informed how he wanted to spend his time post-career in business.
What Giorgio’s day-to-day is like as Director of Football Strategy for Juventus.
Why Giorgio invested in LAFC and what he thinks about the future of the MLS.
What American owners and investors can learn from European soccer clubs and owners, and what European clubs and owners can learn from American owners and investors.
Thanks, Giorgio, for sharing your wisdom, expertise, and enthusiasm at the intersection of sports and business.
Note: this episode was filmed in October 2025 with a plan to publish the conversation around the World Cup.

Show Notes
00:00 Split Second Decision
01:06 A Message from Our Sponsor, Ultimus
02:10 Meet Giorgio Chiellini
04:17 What Is the Juventus Creator Lab
04:36 Building Fans Through Content
05:27 Football Brand Goes Global
06:15 Revenue From Winning
06:43 Two Hearts One Club
07:52 Winning Versus Storytelling
08:40 Fans Everywhere Now
09:27 Too Many Games Problem
09:51 Stakeholders and Calendar
11:00 Owner Advice Communication
11:28 From Kid to Club 
14:12 Film Study for Matches
15:02 The Saka Tactical Foul
17:26 Social Media and Mental Health
29:32 US World Cup Reality
29:45 Grassroots Long Game
30:09 MLS and USL Momentum
30:14 Stadiums and Growth
30:20 MLS Season vs Playoffs
30:46 Supporters Shield Incentives
31:11 Travel and Rest Mentality
31:33 Europe Stakes Comparison
31:54 Highlights Era Question
32:24 Bite-Sized Sports Culture
33:40 Choosing What to Watch
33:55 Sports Must Adapt
34:33 Owners Business View
35:15 TV Rights and Strategy
36:05 Institutional Money Trend
36:42 Why Funds Love Sports
37:04 Balancing Profit and Emotion
38:12 Fiduciary Duty vs Winning
39:15 Permanent Capital Advantage
40:42 Mission Values Legacy
41:54 Juventus DNA and Family
44:31 Leadership Lessons Learned
45:38 From Captain to Executive
47:05 Humanity and Energy
48:21 Player to Business Challenges
50:00 Investing in Italian Startups
51:47 How He Picks Investments
52:43 Innovation and AI in Sport
53:16 Favorite Alternative Investment
54:34 Profitability and Winning
55:21 Closing

A Word from Our Sponsor, Ultimus
This episode of Alt Goes Mainstream is brought to you by Ultimus, the full-service fund administrator and transfer agent powering asset managers in private and public markets. As alts go mainstream, you need real expertise to handle complex fund structures, connect with key distribution partners, and handle sophisticated compliance, reporting, and transparency demands.
That’s Ultimus: high-tech, high-touch solutions for over 450 clients and 2,500 funds with $775B in assets under administration. Backed by an expert team of over 1,200 employees, they place client service at the core of their business, helping you navigate complexity during your fund structuring or launch and then supporting you through every stage of growth. Whether you’re already in the market or thinking about entering private wealth, you can trust their team’s deep expertise in retail alternatives to help you reach your goals.
Learn more at ultimusfundsolutions.com or email info@ultimusfundsolutions.com.
We thank Ultimus for their support of alts going mainstream.
Editing and post-production work for this episode was provided by The Podcast Consultant.

Welcome back to the Alt Goes Mainstream podcast.
Today’s conversation provides a fascinating window into the world of how one of the industry’s largest wealth managers approaches private markets.
We sat down with the man who holds the keys to the kingdom.
Mark Sutterlin is the Head of Alternative Investments within the Investment Solutions Group at Bank of America. He leads the firm’s strategy and platform development across hedge funds, private credit, private equity, physical precious metals, and real estate, delivering a broad spectrum of institutional-grade investment solutions to advisors and their clients.
Mark brings the advisor’s perspective to bear as he builds the alternative investments menu for Merrill and Bank of America Private Bank and helps educate advisors and clients on how and where to thoughtfully and appropriately include private markets in portfolios.
Mark and I had a fascinating discussion. We covered:
How GPs can work with private banks.
What one of the largest private wealth allocators looks for in GPs.
How Merrill approaches different product structures to deliver solutions across the wealth client spectrum.
What constitutes a manager’s edge.
I loved this conversation with Mark, who takes such a thoughtful approach and brings a true passion to helping clients and advisors build and protect wealth.
Thanks Mark for sharing your expertise, wisdom, and passion on private markets and private wealth.
Show Notes
00:00 Investor Edge Beyond Returns
00:32 Sponsor Message from Ultimus
01:41 Meet Mark Sutterlin
04:15 Advisor Trust and Responsibility
04:24 Penetration Across Wealth Tiers
04:38 Scaling Alts Across Books
04:49 Evergreen to Drawdown Spectrum
05:12 Building the Shelf Challenge
05:32 Evergreen Role in Portfolios
05:42 Serving Broad Client Needs
06:06 Optionality Not One Product
06:20 Diligence as Core Identity
06:48 Nuance in Private Credit
07:27 Long-Term Themes Overlay
07:56 Core and Satellite Question
08:28 Drawdown vs Evergreen Tradeoffs
08:48 Advisor Client Feedback Loop
09:25 Evergreens Now Dominate Flows
09:49 Evergreen Growing Pains
10:14 Education and Expectations
10:42 Rotation Within Evergreens
11:11 Who Can Run Evergreens Well
11:35 Scale Deal Flow Allocation Policy
12:29 Post Sale Servicing Matters
12:52 How Managers Should Service
13:23 Transparency Builds Loyalty
14:03 Vetting Managers for Private Banks
14:45 Investor Skill Is Table Stakes
15:22 Thousand Funds Deep Diligence
16:07 Unpacking Firm DNA
16:23 Private Wealth Is High Touch
16:53 Eyes Wide Open Expectations
17:14 Best GPs Listen and Adapt
18:12 Customization Versus Scale
19:13 Specialists and Custom Funds
19:57 Proposal Tools for Advisors
20:43 Menu Design From Client Needs
21:25 Differentiation in UHNW
22:31 Co-Invest and Capacity Access
24:43 Tech DLT and Streamlining
25:38 Biggest Blocker Education Gap
26:45 Misconception Complexity
27:52 Alts Invitationals Bootcamp
29:45 Where Advisors Are Today
30:16 What Why How Framework
31:32 Implementation Needs Support
31:51 Scaling the Alts Business
32:45 Open Architecture Platform
33:01 Lifecycle Ops Risk Controls
33:40 Where to Invest Next
33:53 Infrastructure and DLT Readiness
34:42 Future Growth Sources
35:37 Advisors Yet to Adopt
36:00 Balanced Growth Outlook
36:58 Client Sentiment Today
38:11 Patience and Long-Term Adoption
38:51 Next Gen Investor Mindset
40:43 Defining a Manager’s Edge
41:23 Specialization and Storytelling
42:31 Building a Menu of Edges
42:47 Business Plan Plus Open Mind
43:44 Advice for GPs Pitching Merrill
44:39 Platform Differentiation and Exclusivity
46:47 What Worries Mark Today
48:19 Excited About AI and Infrastructure
50:42 Wrap Up and Thanks

A Word from Our Sponsor, Ultimus
This episode of Alt Goes Mainstream is brought to you by Ultimus, the full-service fund administrator and transfer agent powering asset managers in private and public markets. As alts go mainstream, you need real expertise to handle complex fund structures, connect with key distribution partners, and handle sophisticated compliance, reporting, and transparency demands.
That’s Ultimus: high-tech, high-touch solutions for over 450 clients and 2,500 funds with $775B in assets under administration. Backed by an expert team of over 1,200 employees, they place client service at the core of their business, helping you navigate complexity during your fund structuring or launch and then supporting you through every stage of growth. Whether you’re already in the market or thinking about entering private wealth, you can trust their team’s deep expertise in retail alternatives to help you reach your goals.
Learn more at ultimusfundsolutions.com or email info@ultimusfundsolutions.com.
We thank Ultimus for their support of alts going mainstream.
Editing and post-production work for this episode was provided by The Podcast Consultant.

Welcome to the 20th episode of the Alts Pulse, a collaboration between iCapital x Alt Goes Mainstream. 
In the latest episode of the Alts Pulse, we were live from iCapital Connect. iCapital Managing Director, Head of Private Asset Research & Model Portfolios, Kunal Shah, and I had a conversation about how to marry an institutional allocator’s mindset with the nuances of serving wealth clients.
Kunal brings an institutional allocator’s mindset to the wealth channel. At iCapital, he’s focused on the identification, selection, and due diligence of private equity funds offered on the Flagship Platform. Prior to iCapital, Kunal was a Principal in the private markets group at Meketa Investment Group, a leading global investment consultant serving pension funds, endowments and foundations, and family offices. In that role, Kunal was responsible for leading and managing private equity fund investments. He joined Meketa in 2006 and invested globally, covering buyouts, venture capital, private debt, natural resources, and infrastructure investments. He also developed and led Meketa’s secondary funds purchase practice. Kunal has also served on various LP advisory boards. Prior to Meketa, Kunal was an analyst at The Vanguard Group. 

Kunal and I finally turned all those hallway conversations we had at iCapital’s old office of 441 Lexington into a podcast! We had a fascinating discussion about how to evaluate alternative asset managers and what makes a great manager. We covered:
How should wealth managers approach private markets?
Why it’s important to “always be committed” rather than try to time vintages.
Are evergreen structures a “game changer” for the wealth channel and a foundational piece for model portfolios?
What features does a GP need to run an evergreen fund structure?
What does the centralization of the CIO function and OCIO consolidation in the wealth channel mean for GPs?
Thanks, Kunal, for sharing your passion, wisdom, and expertise at the intersection of private markets and private wealth, and for a great conversation that tied together how private markets and private wealth are changing as new product structures and product innovation take shape.