Unchained

Digital Asset’s CEO faces pointed questions about Canton’s core claims and admits something surprising about the network’s architecture.

========================================================

As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD. 

You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security. 

Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained.  

Ether.fi is giving Unchained listeners 15% cashback on food and ride apps — and that's on top of the 3% you get on everything else. 

Your bank is charging you to use your own money. Laura switched and loves her card!

Go to ether.fi/unchained to claim your offer.

========================================================

Canton is the chain behind JPMorgan’s deposit token, DTCC, Broadridge’s $400 billion repo book, HSBC, Visa, and a growing roster of the biggest names in global finance. It describes itself as a public permissionless blockchain. But is it? 

Yuval Rooz, co-founder and CEO of Digital Asset, faces off against Alex Gluchowski, co-founder and CEO of Matter Labs, and Dragonfly managing partner Haseeb Qureshi in a live debate. 

The charges range from foundational: Canton cannot enforce financial rules without a trusted third party, its validators are permissioned in everything but name, and there is no universally shared ledger. Rooz fires back on all of it and, at one point, concedes something that may surprise you. 

If the label matters as much as the technology, this episode will force you to decide what blockchain actually means, and whether that answer has consequences for the institutions staking their infrastructure on it.

Host:


⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained

Guests:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Yuval Rooz: Co-Founder & CEO, Digital Asset



Haseeb Qureshi: Managing Partner, Dragonfly



Alex Gluchowski: Co-Founder & CEO, Matter Labs

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The $290 million Kelp DAO hack, attributed to North Korea's Lazarus Group, has DeFi TVL down $13 billion in 48 hours. Do DeFi's foundational assumptions need to change?

---

Heads up!

If you haven’t yet, be sure to subscribe to Bits + Bips, since the show will migrate there in a few weeks. Follow us on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, X, Unchained and wherever you get your podcasts.

----

DeFi TVL fell from $99.5 to $86.3 billion in 48 hours after the $290 million Kelp DAO exploit — the latest nine-figure attack attributed to North Korea's Lazarus Group, this time via a compromised Layer Zero bridge. 

Meanwhile, a new class of yield-bearing instrument is staking a claim on capital fleeing private credit: Apyx's APY USD, backed by Strategy's STRC preferred stock, launched on Kraken this week with a 12% yield target and $180 million in supply after just seven weeks. Is STRC-backed yield a legitimate financial primitive, or a Bitcoin derivative with extra steps? 

And as DeFi absorbs yet another devastating security failure, is the industry's core assumption — that incoming transactions should be treated as legitimate — finally due for an overhaul? Austin Campbell, Ram Ahluwalia, and Chris Perkins dig in with Parker White of Apyx and Michael Bentley of Euler.

Hosts:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Campbell⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host of Bits + Bips, Zero Knowledge Consulting


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Ram Ahluwalia⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of Lumida


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Chris Perkins⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Co-Host, CEO of 250 Digital Asset Management

Hosts:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Parker White — @TheOtherParker_ — Founding Contributor, Apyx.


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Michael Bentley — @euler_mab — Former CEO, Euler Labs

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Bitcoin's spot-led rally looks healthy on the surface. But derivatives say conviction is thin. Josh Lim from FalconX on what the market structure is actually telling you right now.

---

Thank you to our sponsors!

MultiChain Advisors is an emerging technology growth firm that has helped create $50B+ in enterprise value for 80+ clients over the past 4 years. They're the partner to help navigate markets. 

Build real traction today at multichainadv.com

As Bitcoin's application layer, Citrea gives you access to the first trust-minimized BTC on a fully programmable platform and a native stablecoin for Bitcoin, ctUSD. 

You can now participate in Bitcoin capital markets with lending, privacy, payments, Bitcoin yield, trading and predictions. You get expanded Bitcoin utility without sacrificing its security. 

Citrea mainnet is live. Put your BTC to work at citrea.xyz/unchained. 

---

Bitcoin is trading near $75,000, but the market structure around it tells a more complicated story. Implied volatility has collapsed to sub-50, funding rates are negative, and the options market is dominated by sellers, not buyers. Meanwhile, Bitcoin miners are liquidating holdings to fund the transition to high-performance compute, generating a persistent offer just as breakeven retail holders look for an exit. 

FalconX Global Co-Head of Markets Josh Lim joins Steve Ehrlich to map exactly what is keeping Bitcoin range-bound, where the rotation into ETH and alts is actually coming from, and what signals in derivatives and on-chain data would indicate the market is ready to move. 

They also get into whether the Clarity Act changes the long-term structure of the altcoin market, how Hyperliquid is being used for institutional RWA arbitrage, and what the quantum threat means not for cryptography, but for trading Bitcoin.

Host:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Steven Ehrlich⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Head of Research, SharpLink

Guest:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Josh Lim — Global Co-Head of Markets, FalconX. Repeat guest; previously covered market structure and institutional crypto flows on Bits + Bips.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Quantum computing risk, USDC vs. Tether drama after the Drift hack, and World Liberty Financial’s governance circus take center stage as Haseeb, Tom, Tarun, and special guest Joshua Lim dissect market signals, institutional FUD, Trumpcoin shenanigans, and ask: is crypto VC dead or just getting started?

Welcome to The Chopping Block — where crypto insiders Haseeb Qureshi, Tom Schmidt, Tarun Chitra, and Robert Leshner chop it up about the latest in crypto. This week, the crew is joined by special guest Joshua Lim, Head of Derivatives at FalconX (and self-described Quantum FUD Whisperer). Ever wondered what happens when a quantum computer finally threatens public key cryptography? We break down the real and imagined risks of “Q Day,” what markets are actually pricing in, and why watching for Satoshi’s coins moving is still the ultimate market panic trigger.

Next up, the hosts tackle the messiest storyline in stablecoins: the massive Drift hack, North Korea’s role, and the blame game between USDC and Tether. Is Circle’s “wait for the court order” approach defensible, or are PR wins up for grabs for whoever moves fastest?

We would never forget the crypto car crash that is World Liberty Financial: from drama-filled governance votes that magically extend lockups, to Justin Sun’s redemption arc versus Trumpcoin, to whale-scale DeFi leverage that could nuke a protocol. It’s a masterclass in governance theater and permissioned shenanigans.

Finally, we level with all the “crypto venture is dead” crowd — who’s still building, where the real capital is now, and why bear markets always demand an extra shot of conviction.

From quantum nightmares to meme coin melodrama, let’s get into it.

Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pods, Fountain, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform.

Show highlights

🔹“Q Day” decoded: What quantum risk really means for Bitcoin and the markets  

🔹 How institutional allocators cite quantum FUD — but are they just making excuses?  

🔹 Why “watching for Satoshi’s coins moving” would nuke market confidence  

🔹 Drift hack dissected: USDC vs. Tether, North Korea fingerprints, and Circle’s PR headache  

🔹 Is Circle’s don’t-freeze-without-court-order policy defensible or just bad optics?  

🔹 World Liberty Financial’s (Trumpcoin) greatest hits: forced lockups, governance theater, and Justin Sun’s crusade  

🔹 Tether’s “PR coup” and the stablecoin migration on Solana  

🔹 Are most crypto VCs washed? Debating the right-sizing of venture capital in the bear  

🔹 Hot takes on “revenue meta,” mature infrastructure, and why there’s less room for dreamers  

🔹 Who’s actually still building in crypto — and why cycles always come back

Hosts

⭐️Haseeb Qureshi, Managing Partner at Dragonfly

⭐️Tarun Chitra, Managing Partner at Robot Ventures

⭐️Tom Schmidt, General Partner at Dragonfly 

Guest

⭐️ Joshua Lim, Head of Markets at FalconX

Links:

Joshua Lim’s Q-Day Thread: ⁠https://x.com/joshua_j_lim/status/2044602429002367330?s=20⁠

Disclosures
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Debanked 12 times. Walked through an airport in handcuffs. Every charge eventually gone. Nader Al-Naji on the defense strategy that convinced both agencies to back off.

========================================================

Nexo is the premier digital wealth platform. Receive interest on your crypto, borrow against it without selling, and trade a range of assets. Now available in the U.S with 30 days of exclusive privileges. 

Get started at http://nexo.com/unchained

========================================================

In July 2024, Nader Al-Naji was preparing to board a flight to Turkey when the FBI arrested him in front of with his wife and son and walked him in handcuffs through the airport. 

The DOJ and SEC had jointly charged the DESO and BitClout founder with defrauding investors of $3 million and running an unregistered securities offering. Twenty months later, both cases are gone: the DOJ dismissed in March 2025, the SEC dismissed with prejudice — meaning it can’t be refiled — in March 2026. 

Nader tells Laura what actually happened, from the FBI raid on his Beverly Hills home and the clerical error that sent him to federal prison for a weekend, to the legal strategy that convinced both agencies to back off. He also revisits the BitClout celebrity era, the long call with Do Kwon before Terra launched, and the debanking tactic he calls ‘subpoena sniping.’

Host:


⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained

Guests:


⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Nader Al-Naji (@nadertheory), Founder of DESO and BitClout

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices